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Re: [gNewSense-users] ytplay updated - playing Youtube videos on gNewSen

From: Kevin Dean
Subject: Re: [gNewSense-users] ytplay updated - playing Youtube videos on gNewSense.
Date: Fri, 8 Feb 2008 15:18:30 -0500

I'm quite aware that dpkg can handle these. One of my favorite aspects
of dpkg is pressing "Y" rather than having my config files run over. I
am not saying there is not TECHNICAL capability to do a successful
upgrade (I've got a once-Potato server running Etch right now with
minor issues).

I like to see that comes "Default". This is why I install Debian fresh
every week. I like to see changes to Debian Installer. I like to see
what the default environment includes, and try to reason why.
Sometimes, I am surprised (Dasher is part of Lenny now.)

I'n not saying you can't have a stable system from a dist-upgrade, you can.

I'm saying you can't have the system that the distro designers planned
for you to have and considering the relatively small pool of
developers that gNewSense has, I think it would just be easier to
recommend a fresh install. Given the frequency that a point-oh version
will hit by following the LTS schedule, I don't think that's wholey
unreasonable. Indeed, there are possibilities to solve with Free
Software things that users aren't solving right now for whatever

I didn't mean this to get into a discussion about how to manage a
system. I thought I made it clear that my methods were my personal
preference, and NOT my recommendation for the distro.

-Kevin Dean

On Feb 8, 2008 2:01 PM, Justin Baugh <address@hidden> wrote:
> > I also trust that they won't be able to pull it off, quite frankly.
> > They can't even ensure clean upgrades from Feisty to Gusty and frankly
> > I'm not sure I'd agree that TRYING to do that is a wise decision. I
> > may be biased, having run Debian Sid for the past several years, but I
> > have found that "user settings" are as often a cause of breakage than
> > distro-supplied settings. That's why I re-install Debian every week,
> > because without a fresh install you're not really getting the benefit
> > for all of the minor (read: config) changes that take place - like
> > artwork, cursors, fonts, resolution settings, sound configuration,
> > file manager defaults and so on.
> :OOO Sorry but this approach is insane. Or likely to put you there.
> I agree with Yavor completely....The vast majority of these things are
> going to be handled by dpkg, and in the event that you modified a config
> file for a service, or whatever...You really should not be saying no to
> dpkg questions without examining the files in question first.
> Although I agree that custom settings (i.e. my own custom version of
> /etc/wtf.conf) can cause issues when I go and dist-upgrade. When dpkg
> asks you about this, and you just yell "OVERWRITE MY WTF.CONF! NEVAR!!!"
> - you should, in general, expect problems.
> Speaking of Ubuntu, it's rather possible to upgrade from Dapper to Gutsy
> in one go. You just have to be willing to massage it a little (i.e. deal
> with package name changes/removals/metapackage changes, etc). But it is
> possible, and it doesn't really require intimate knowledge of dpkg, just
> patience.
> As far as upgrades go....I would wager that a wide majority of these
> issues are caused by people having Bob knows what in their sources.list
> - as well as using that godforsaken tool Automatix. Do you really think
> that legions of people who only use Ubuntu/Debian apt archives are
> experiencing problems doing dist upgrades? I dunno..maybe, but that
> definitely hasn't been my experience.
> The biggest issue I've had in terms of Gnome and friends is when I take
> a very old home directory, say, from around Dapper time, and use it on
> something from around Gutsy time. Weirdness is almost always the result.
> But that's a user config issue, not a system issue, and should be
> handled by the user (or a tool made available to the user). I don't
> think it's the packaging system's job to make sure my gnome config files
> are understandable and usable by newer versions of programs - that's
> Gnome's job.
> -Justin
> --
> Justin Baugh (baughj at gnu dot org)
> Senior Systems Administrator
> Free Software Foundation
> _______________________________________________
> gNewSense-users mailing list
> address@hidden

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