[gnugo-devel] RE: gnugo-devel Digest, Vol 2, Issue 29

[Jeffrey Greenberg]

Regarding GMP w/out two machines:
The following scenario may help:
run the program with i/o through com1
use a serial crossover calbe to com2
use
OpenGo, http://www.inventivity.com/OpenGo, to run GMP and control GnuGo, or
whatever engine you wnat to interface it to... OpenGO supports gnugo via GMP
but not GTK currently
OpenGo is opensource

j

-----Original Message-----
From: address@hidden
[mailto:address@hidden Behalf Of
address@hidden
Sent: Thursday, January 16, 2003 3:47 AM
To: address@hidden
Subject: gnugo-devel Digest, Vol 2, Issue 29


Send gnugo-devel mailing list submissions to
        address@hidden

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
        http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnugo-devel
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
        address@hidden

You can reach the person managing the list at
        address@hidden

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of gnugo-devel digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. Re: Move valuation question
   2. Re: Another tuning patch  (Gunnar Farneback)
   3. Re: tactical attack cleanup  (Gunnar Farneback)
   4. Re: GMP w/out two machines? (Dave Denholm)
   5. Re: GMP w/out two machines? (Trevor Morris)
   6. Re: GMP w/out two machines? (Dave Denholm)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 09:54:02 -0800
From: <address@hidden>
To: address@hidden
Subject: Re: [gnugo-devel] Move valuation question
Message-ID: <address@hidden>
In-Reply-To: <address@hidden>
        (message from Portela Fernand on Wed, 15 Jan 2003 16:45:29 +0100)
References: <address@hidden>
Precedence: list
Reply-To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Message: 1


> Isn't this a bit exagerated ? I mean, let's imagine we're only 2.5 pts
> behind and a group worth 40 pts is in danger. Don't you think GG would be
> taking way too much risks in such case ?

Certainly, you are right.

> I'm not sure what to do, but what about following ?
>
>         this_value = 2*dragon[aa].effective_size - gg_abs(score);
>         if (this_value < 0.0)
>           this_value = 0.0;

This doesn't look right to me, however. Suppose you are
fifteen points behind. Practically any dragon on the board
will have effective size 7.5 or more, so this statement
has no effect. Yet the right thing may be to gamble and
rip sente. Assume the uncertain result is right and go on,
or defend and fall further behind.

Of course sometimes a defensive move can be worth real
points. In that case, if we can detect this fact, we
should pay attention to the uncertain owl defense.

What we really need is an additional certainty
estimate---we need to know not only whether the owl
result is certain. We also need to know whether the
score estimate is certain, for example, how far we
are from the end of the game.

Dan



------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 21:21:20 +0100
From: Gunnar Farneback <address@hidden>
To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Subject: Re: [gnugo-devel] Another tuning patch
Message-ID: <address@hidden>
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Tue, 14 Jan 2003 17:54:51 EST."
             <address@hidden>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.3 - "Ushinoya")
Precedence: list
Reply-To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Message: 2

Trevor wrote:
> G16 is clearly best in this case.  These other 2 options (A18|A16)
> provide (extra, and likely a potentially infinite supply of) ko threats to
W.

Agreed.

> Perhaps it's not worth regressing over, though...

I don't think it is. Currently GNU Go is nowhere close to being able
to understand this issue. The important thing is that it avoids the
disastrous ko occuring in the game.

/Gunnar


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 21:38:40 +0100
From: Gunnar Farneback <address@hidden>
To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Subject: Re: [gnugo-devel] tactical attack cleanup
Message-ID: <address@hidden>
In-Reply-To: Your message of "Wed, 15 Jan 2003 00:11:15 EST."
             <address@hidden>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
MIME-Version: 1.0 (generated by SEMI 1.14.3 - "Ushinoya")
Precedence: list
Reply-To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Message: 3

Evan wrote:
> So anyway, after a bit of a hiatus, I thought I might go finish up that
> long overdue tactics cleanup.  I don't have timings, but attached is the
> regression delta and node counts.

I measure a node count increase of 0.13%, i.e. negligible.

> All the changes appear to be related to the change in the trymove
> setup, which now allows defender to pass,

The defender was allowed to pass before too (or strictly speaking the
attacker was and is required to demonstrate that it can capture),
except in find_cap2(). That was probably unintentional but I'm not
sure it was technically a bug since I can't figure a position where a
string with at most four liberties is capped (as defined by the
find_cap code) and then forced to fill an eye or break a seki if it's
not allowed to pass.

> and force the reading deeper.

This is slightly problematic. The reading in test case reading:178 now
hits a depth limit and is actually worse than before, in spite of the
PASS.

> -
> -    if (edge_closing_backfill(str, apos, &xpos))
> -      ADD_CANDIDATE_MOVE(xpos, 10, moves);
> -

This bonus of 10 for the move ordering is lost after the patch. I'm
not sure it's worth fixing though.

Overall I think the patch looks fine.

/Gunnar


------------------------------

Date: 15 Jan 2003 21:34:53 +0000
From: Dave Denholm <address@hidden>
To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Subject: Re: [gnugo-devel] GMP w/out two machines?
Message-ID: <address@hidden>
In-Reply-To: Trevor Morris's message of Tue, 14 Jan 2003 18:06:05 -0500
References: <address@hidden>
Precedence: list
Reply-To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Message: 4

Trevor Morris <address@hidden> writes:

> Does anyone know of software to allow two programs to play using
> GMP w/out having 2 computers connected w/ a serial cable?
> [I don't even have 2 serial ports on my machine.]
>

What o/s is running on the computer ?

What questions does the program ask ? Does it take control of
parity, baud rate etc, or does it assume they are already set up ?


dd
--
address@hidden          http://www.insignia.com


------------------------------

Date: Wed, 15 Jan 2003 18:38:05 -0500
From: Trevor Morris <address@hidden>
To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>,
 GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Subject: Re: [gnugo-devel] GMP w/out two machines?
Message-ID: <address@hidden>
In-Reply-To: <address@hidden>
References: <Trevor Morris's message of Tue, 14 Jan 2003 18:06:05 -0500>
 <address@hidden>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
MIME-Version: 1.0
Precedence: list
Reply-To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Message: 5

At 09:34 PM 1/15/2003 +0000, Dave Denholm wrote:
>Trevor Morris <address@hidden> writes:
>
>> Does anyone know of software to allow two programs to play using
>> GMP w/out having 2 computers connected w/ a serial cable?
>> [I don't even have 2 serial ports on my machine.]
>>
>
>What o/s is running on the computer ?
Windows 2000

>What questions does the program ask ? Does it take control of
>parity, baud rate etc, or does it assume they are already set up ?
Serial Number (COM) only.

Here's a link to a non-free product that would solve the problem, I think:
http://www.mks.zp.ua/vspdxp.php

-Trevor




------------------------------

Date: 16 Jan 2003 00:06:47 +0000
From: Dave Denholm <address@hidden>
To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Subject: Re: [gnugo-devel] GMP w/out two machines?
Message-ID: <address@hidden>
In-Reply-To: Trevor Morris's message of Wed, 15 Jan 2003 18:38:05 -0500
References: <Trevor Morris's message of Tue, 14 Jan 2003 18:06:05 -0500>
        <address@hidden>
        <address@hidden>
Precedence: list
Reply-To: GNU Go development <address@hidden>
Message: 6

Trevor Morris <address@hidden> writes:

> At 09:34 PM 1/15/2003 +0000, Dave Denholm wrote:
> >Trevor Morris <address@hidden> writes:
> >
> >> Does anyone know of software to allow two programs to play using
> >> GMP w/out having 2 computers connected w/ a serial cable?
> >> [I don't even have 2 serial ports on my machine.]
> >>
> >
> >What o/s is running on the computer ?
> Windows 2000
>
> >What questions does the program ask ? Does it take control of
> >parity, baud rate etc, or does it assume they are already set up ?
> Serial Number (COM) only.
>

Okay, I'm pretty sure that windows lets you use 'redirectors' to
trap access to COM ports. This is how it does remote drives, etc.

Searching on google for "com port redirector" threw up some hits.
Don't know if anything is free, though.

www.sena.com seem to be offering something free ???

dd
--
address@hidden          http://www.insignia.com


------------------------------

_______________________________________________
gnugo-devel mailing list
address@hidden
http://mail.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/gnugo-devel


End of gnugo-devel Digest, Vol 2, Issue 29
******************************************