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Re: [Gnustep-marketing] GNUstep Foundation

From: MJ Ray
Subject: Re: [Gnustep-marketing] GNUstep Foundation
Date: Fri, 01 Oct 2004 10:59:38 +0100

On 2004-10-01 07:39:15 +0100 Nicolas Roard <address@hidden> wrote:

> Le 1 oct. 04, à 01:02, MJ Ray a écrit :
>> They should care/help because GNUstep is part of the FSF's GNU project. I 
>> think you are extrapolating too far from that one web page.
> they "should" care but they don't. They have enough work of their own, and 
> plenty of others projects to think about..

What are you basing this on? Why does everyone else seem to have "go away" 
emails from FSF, but no-one has posted one?

> ... ok... so, you agree that we need our own group for promote GNUstep, and 
> we need to do our own fundraising as well.
> Instead of doing that individually, it's then quite logical to create some 
> entity to do that. That's why we advocate a GNUstep Foundation.

The GNUstep Foundation was originally proposed only to handle funds, not to 
promote or do fundraising itself. I think I am justified in questioning this 
feature creep. Everyone seems to have their own different desires for a GNUstep 
Foundation, which makes discussing it like being swamped with custard: the only 
way out is to eat it, but I'm not hungry for it.

> If nobody really bother to use the FSF for doing the fundraising and the 
> promoting, it's quite logically because FSF and GNUstep has different goals, 
> and the FSF is not architectured to deal with that. [...]

Why is this logical? It hasn't happened, therefore this one reason is the 

Nevertheless, using the FSF for fundraising and promoting is not my proposal. 
Again, this has gone off-topic.

> And frankly, I prefer to have GNUstep people in charge of that than FSF 
> people not involved in the project.

Why would it not be FSF appointing people involved in the project, as present?

> I really don't understand your problem. You act like this foundation will be 
> totally separated from the project and like the people possibly in charge 
> won't be steppers, and that foundation could take over the project. [...]

That is how I have understood the explainations until today. According to 
those, the foundation will hire and fire developers, and the foundation must 
have non-developer managers to be seen as legitimate. I am worried that this 
foundation has the unthinking uncritical support of developers, so the real 
GNUstep will be left as a poor relation, like the AI lab after LMI and 

> I don't really think we can have worse marketing than what we have now [...]

Marketing was not a suggested role of the foundation. Also, I think you are 
being rude to those who have tried in the past by calling their efforts 

We need to do more marketing, but setting up a corporation is a huge piece of 
work and long-term investment which will do little to help with it.

MJR/slef    My Opinion Only and not of any group I know
 Creative copyleft computing - village 6+7 Oct

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