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Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??
From: |
Duncan |
Subject: |
Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post?? |
Date: |
Thu, 12 Dec 2002 11:40:11 -0700 |
User-agent: |
KMail/1.5 |
On Wed 11 Dec 2002 14:41, Beartooth posted as excerpted below:
> On Tue, 10 Dec 2002, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom wrote:
> > GTK is the 'toolkit' or 'widget set' that Gnome is built with.
> > Gnome is the environment, GTK is the building-block
>
> And Gnome hasn't gotten to gtk2 yet? So if I download and
> install gtk2 it will replace gtk1 and break things? Or is there
> backward compatibility that a subtechnoid can count on? I'll get it
> if I dare -- I feel like more of a fossil than usual, running 0.11
<g> on that fossil ref... Gnome 2 is indeed out. Running them side-by-side
is supposed to be possible, but most distribs package it as a replacement,
rather than for side-by-side use, AFAIK. The easiest thing to do for a less
technically oriented person would be to simply install the newest version of
the distrib, as you were thinking of doing on a different hard drive.
> > this is another reason I like Debian. there's no big upgrade
> > steps; it's just a smooth curve (if you follow testing or
> > unstable). bugs may appear, but they get hammered out pretty
> > fast.
That sounds like Mandrake, using urpmi, if you point it to a Cooker mirror.
The biggest difficulty I had was when I first tried it, and had the huge
initial upgrade, since what I had locally was rather behind by then. Besides
a few dependency issues that I had to resolve manually, like with the
GTK/Gnome 1 vs. 2 stuff, and the same with KDE 2.2 vs. 3.0, there was a devfs
update, that used a different and separately packaged module which wasn't in
the dependencies because it was more like an added feature -- only one that
something else DID depend on. I rebooted and devfs didn't load, which meant
that its handling of legacy /dev references didn't load either, including
/dev/hda etc. references. I had to work with a bare rootfs loaded, no /usr
or /home, no swap, etc. Since the dependencies for VIM and MC were on /usr,
I couldn't run them, either. I had to get out my trusty "rearing horse" and
"the Arabian" (O'Reilly's "Running Linux" and "Linux in a Nutshell"), and
learn enough SED on the fly to use it as an editor, first to display fstab,
then to modify it to use the long /dev/ide strings rather than /dev/hda type
strings. Once I did that, I could mount my other partitions, and get on the
net using lynx to figure out what was wrong with devfs, remove the conf file
dependency on the other module, check that it worked then, then download the
module and install it, and reenable the conf file dependency.
I was pretty proud of the fact that I was able to do all that without
resorting to my old W98 install to get on the net and read about it or ask
questions in the newsgroups, as I did, with the first few problems I'd had on
initial install. (Those problems were LILO booting a triple-drive system
with BIOS drive order switching, and figuring out how to get X running on all
three of my monitors, as the Mdk GUI front-end to reconfiguring XF86Config
couldn't quite stretch it's feeble brain around the concept of my actually
wanting to run THREE monitors on TWO video cards. Obviously not your typical
user type problems, since "typical users" don't HAVE three monitor displays,
and if they have three hard drives, they are willing to let them stay in
whatever order they happen to come up.)
> In my youth I helped an uncle clear brush from a farm that
> hadn't been worked in twenty years. You just keep cutting what hits
> you in the face next, and eventually things get to where you can
> build brush piles -- even if it feels at times like you'll never
> get out again. Sometimes all this stuff feels that way, too.
That's a rather accurate analogy, I think. <g> I had some experience with
similar brush clearing type tasks, as a kid, although not /quite/ as
dramatic.
> There we differ -- maybe because I don't (yet?) see the
> commands as sentences. I spent a couple years trying to teach
> myself linux out of manuals -- with RH 6 on the second hard drive
> -- and getting nowhere. It was only when I broke down and started
> using the GUI that I got far enough to be able to *do* anything
> while I'm learning. Visual memory supplies a crutch that helps me.
I'd seriously recommend the books I mentioned above, O'Reilly's Running Linux,
and Linux in a Nutshell. Together, they set me back about $70 US, but I'd
not been getting anywhere in my Linux meanderings before that, as I was
simply /lost/. They saved me at LEAST three months of HARD learning, and
allowed me with some effort to enter Linux at the intermediate user /
beginning sysadmin level. I've mentioned above two of the three initial
problems I faced, and another one I faced later, all pretty much ONLY fixable
at the low-level, in the text interface, or at least by direct editing of the
text config files, rather than pushing buttons in a GUI config. None of that
would have been possible at that early stage, had I not read those books. I
consider them some of the best investments I've ever made in my decade plus
of computer experience (a decade on MSWormOS, just over a year on Linux).
--
Duncan
"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little
temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." --
Benjamin Franklin
- [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Beartooth, 2002/12/09
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Jim Henderson, 2002/12/09
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Duncan, 2002/12/09
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Beartooth, 2002/12/10
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom, 2002/12/10
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Beartooth, 2002/12/11
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??,
Duncan <=
- OT: Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Eric Ortega, 2002/12/12
- Re: OT: Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Charles Kerr, 2002/12/12
- Re: OT: Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Eric Ortega, 2002/12/12
- Re: OT: Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Duncan, 2002/12/13
- Re: OT: Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Eric Ortega, 2002/12/13
- Re: OT: Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Brian Morrison, 2002/12/13
- Re: OT: Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Eric Ortega, 2002/12/13
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Carl Wilhelm Soderstrom, 2002/12/13
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Eric Ortega, 2002/12/13
- Re: [Pan-users] Click on URL in a post??, Duncan, 2002/12/13