Re: Proper Names - Current State (2003)

[Bruno Haible]

Hello,

Brian Kemp wrote:
> http://www.gnu.org/software/gettext/manual/gettext.html#Names
> 
> "
> 
> The translation project http://sourceforge.net/projects/translation
> has set up a POT file and translation domain consisting of program
> author names, with better facilities for the translator than those
> presented here. Namely, there the original name is written directly in
> Unicode (rather than with Unicode escapes or HTML entities), and the
> pronunciation is denoted using the International Phonetic Alphabet
> (see http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet).
> 
> However, we don't recommend this approach for all POT files in all
> packages, because this would force translators to use PO files in
> UTF-8 encoding, which is - in the current state of software (as of
> 2003) - a major hassle for translators using GNU Emacs or XEmacs with
> po-mode.
> 
> "
> 
> Is this still the case? I figure something has changed in the 5 years
> since this was written. Since I'm learning about how to use gettext to
> work with Sugar, it'd be nice to know if this was still an issue.

You're right. Nowadays Emacs appears to support UTF-8 reasonably well,
and XEmacs has become less relevant.

Also the centralized POT file for author names idea didn't work out. Now
programmers are simply expected to handle author names in their package's
POT file.

Thanks for reporting this. I've updated the doc in the package; it will
be updated on the web site after the next release.

Bruno


2008-05-18  Bruno Haible  <address@hidden>

        * gettext.texi (Names): Recommend the gnulib module 'propername'.
        Don't mention the translation project's whoiswho.pot any more. Don't
        say that Emacs does not support UTF-8 well.
        Reported by Brian Kemp <address@hidden>.

Index: gettext.texi
===================================================================
RCS file: /sources/gettext/gettext/gettext-tools/doc/gettext.texi,v
retrieving revision 1.152
diff -c -3 -r1.152 gettext.texi
*** gettext.texi        6 May 2008 23:18:55 -0000       1.152
--- gettext.texi        18 May 2008 16:15:39 -0000
***************
*** 2642,2648 ****
  
  As a programmer, you should therefore make sure that names are marked
  for translation, with a special comment telling the translators that it
! is a proper name and how to pronounce it.  Like this:
  
  @example
  @group
--- 2642,2649 ----
  
  As a programmer, you should therefore make sure that names are marked
  for translation, with a special comment telling the translators that it
! is a proper name and how to pronounce it.  In its simple form, it looks
! like this:
  
  @example
  @group
***************
*** 2656,2671 ****
  @end group
  @end example
  
  As a translator, you should use some care when translating names, because
! it is frustrating if people see their names mutilated or distorted.  If
! your language uses the Latin script, all you need to do is to reproduce
  the name as perfectly as you can within the usual character set of your
  language.  In this particular case, this means to provide a translation
  containing the c-cedilla character.  If your language uses a different
  script and the people speaking it don't usually read Latin words, it means
! transliteration; but you should still give, in parentheses, the original
! writing of the name -- for the sake of the people that do read the Latin
! script.  Here is an example, using Greek as the target script:
  
  @example
  @group
--- 2657,2704 ----
  @end group
  @end example
  
+ @noindent
+ The GNU gnulib library offers a module @samp{propername}
+ (@url{http://www.gnu.org/software/gnulib/MODULES.html#module=propername})
+ which takes care to automatically append the original name, in parentheses,
+ to the translated name.  For names that cannot be written in ASCII, it
+ also frees the translator from the task of entering the appropriate non-ASCII
+ characters if no script change is needed.  In this more comfortable form,
+ it looks like this:
+ 
+ @example
+ @group
+ printf (_("Written by %s and %s.\n"),
+         proper_name ("Ulrich Drepper"),
+         /* TRANSLATORS: This is a proper name.  See the gettext
+            manual, section Names.  Note this is actually a non-ASCII
+            name: The first name is (with Unicode escapes)
+            "Fran\u00e7ois" or (with HTML entities) "Fran&ccedil;ois".
+            Pronunciation is like "fraa-swa pee-nar".  */
+         proper_name_utf8 ("Francois Pinard", "Fran\303\247ois Pinard"));
+ @end group
+ @end example
+ 
+ @noindent
+ You can also write the original name directly in Unicode (rather than with
+ Unicode escapes or HTML entities) and denote the pronunciation using the
+ International Phonetic Alphabet (see
+ @url{http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet}).
+ 
  As a translator, you should use some care when translating names, because
! it is frustrating if people see their names mutilated or distorted.
! 
! If your language uses the Latin script, all you need to do is to reproduce
  the name as perfectly as you can within the usual character set of your
  language.  In this particular case, this means to provide a translation
  containing the c-cedilla character.  If your language uses a different
  script and the people speaking it don't usually read Latin words, it means
! transliteration.  If the programmer used the simple case, you should still
! give, in parentheses, the original writing of the name -- for the sake of
! the people that do read the Latin script.  If the programmer used the
! @samp{propername} module mentioned above, you don't need to give the original
! writing of the name in parentheses, because the program will already do so.
! Here is an example, using Greek as the target script:
  
  @example
  @group
***************
*** 2683,2701 ****
  Because translation of names is such a sensitive domain, it is a good
  idea to test your translation before submitting it.
  
- The translation project @url{http://sourceforge.net/projects/translation}
- has set up a POT file and translation domain consisting of program author
- names, with better facilities for the translator than those presented here.
- Namely, there the original name is written directly in Unicode (rather
- than with Unicode escapes or HTML entities), and the pronunciation is
- denoted using the International Phonetic Alphabet (see
- @url{http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_Phonetic_Alphabet}).
- 
- However, we don't recommend this approach for all POT files in all packages,
- because this would force translators to use PO files in UTF-8 encoding,
- which is - in the current state of software (as of 2003) - a major hassle
- for translators using GNU Emacs or XEmacs with po-mode.
- 
  @node Libraries,  , Names, Sources
  @section Preparing Library Sources
  
--- 2716,2721 ----