Re: Changes for emacs 28

[Ergus]

On Sat, Sep 12, 2020 at 12:00:48AM +0300, Dmitry Gutov wrote:
> On 11.09.2020 16:04, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> > > Date: Fri, 11 Sep 2020 14:57:44 +0200
> > > From: Ergus <spacibba@aol.com>
> > > Cc: rekado@elephly.net, ghe@sdf.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org,
> > >         drew.adams@oracle.com, dgutov@yandex.ru
> > >
> > > The mode will substitute undo with undo-only. This small contradiction
> > > will start a war here.
> >
> > As long as we keep this on the menu and the tool bar, there will be no
> > reason for a "war".
>
> So there will be contradiction between the menu and the keyboard?
Hopefully not: With the undo-redo-mode; undo icon will do undo-only as
well as the keyboard and toolbar-icon.

Otherwise; maybe it is easier to keep everything there as now (undo and
redo in toolbar and menubar and no undo-redo-mode) but add an option
like default-undo-command to set the undo-only as the default undo
either in the keyboard, toolbar and menubar if someone (like me) don't
like at all the default undo.

I don't know if that's possible with a simple remap... is it?

BTW: everybody agrees in set undo-redo to C-? and M-_??

> > > > > Having undo with an undo-redo in the same "state" could be confusing as
> > > > > the normal undo could do also redo IMO.
> > > >
> > > > If the user uses the menus or the tool bar, the confusion will be
> > > > spared, right?
> > > If the user expects undo-only behavior; then having our undo will be
> > > confusing because not expecting undo becoming a redo at some point.
> >
> > How can it be confusing that 2 different commands produce different
> > results?  Why isn't it confusing today, when we already have these 2
> > commands?
>
> The menu item doesn't exactly say which command it is invoking.
>
> > > IMO we should have one (undo) or the other (undo-only + undo-edor) but
> > > not mix them by default.
> >
> > Whether to mix them or not is up to the user.
>
> This has been true before the menu items were added, and will continue 
> to be true if/when we change the default bindings.
>
> So I think that statement is missing the point: we should endeavor for 
> predictable and consistent sets of menu items, key bindings, and other 
> features.
Personally I still think that a mode is better. But I trust more in Eli's
opinion than mine in this topics.