Re: [libreplanet-discuss] “Promote NoPhone” is a path to nowhere

[Caleb Herbert]

On 09/16/2019 03:23 AM, Dmitry Alexandrov wrote:> Caleb Herbert
<csh@bluehome.net> wrote:
>> Most people cannot access or afford decent Replicant devices.
>
> No people can access or afford _decent_ Replicant devices: they are
simply nonexistent.
I consider the ancient Galaxy S2 decent.

> A device, listed at https://replicant.us (which would _not_ fully work
under it anyway), could be obtained very easily and for a laughable
price, though.
The price is expensive.  Scarcity of after-market devices still in good
condition, combined with the price of paying someone to flash it, costs
five hundred dollars last time I checked.  Most people are not willing
to do that.  It is easier to ask them to stop using phones and give
donations to people working on an acceptable mobile computer.

>> F-Droid is not the answer.  It is a last resort for device addicts to
gain partial freedom.  We should primarily suggest people to not have
mobile devices
>> We should teach them how to live a happy life without them, and how
to do it.
>
> _That_, not some silly ‘statutory rape’ stuff above, is what really
makes RMS views startling: he is a luddite.  I am hardly able to
realise, how could a man who discover and devote his life to promote the
most revolutionary social phenomenon of last 30 years and a man who
believes that we (a) are able to and (b) should try to resist the
technical progress, because besides positive consequences it entails
some negative too, be the same person, but the mobile telephony is not
the only point where he does so.
Unfortunately, a solution does not exist.  We need to pay people to make
the changes we want to see in the world.  I'm sure you'll be more
willing to give more once you start having to manually route your trips
with a dry-erase marker and a map.  This will actually get us somewhere
by paying for the necessary labor we need to make progress.

> And yes, both mobile phones per se and ‘phones’ that you mean (that
is, handheld PCs with modem, navigator, camera, etc, etc built-in) have
been enormous progress.  Calling people, that make use of them,
‘addicts’ is nothing more reasonable, that calling ‘addicts’ people who
have got ‘addicted’ to Internet or ‘addicted’ to hot water.
It is possible to use a phone without addictive behavior, but most
phones are not designed this way.  Companies usually design apps to keep
people on them all the time instead of getting what they need done and
moving on with their lives.

>> We should recognize the needs people fulfill with their phones, and
offer replacements.  We should show testimonies of people who do this
every day successfully, and show that it is possible to live life with
user respecting devices.
>
> Well, you know: it is fully possible to live you life without Internet
and hot water.  I could provide you testimonies from people who do this
successfully, if you will.  ;-)
Internet and hot water do not violate our community standards.

> Luddism is a path that leads no nowhere.
We are not anti-technology.  Evaluating technologies based on a set of
community values makes rejection of technologies inevitable in some
cases.  When possible, we adapt current technologies to fit community
standards.  We use WebRTC, GitLab, Firefox, CHIRP, and VOIP, for example.

Even the Amish use modern technology.  To say Luddites hate modernity is
false.  If we can make something work with our community's values, we
will use it.

It is bad to abandon your values and follow society.  It is bad to stay
follow your values and abandon society.  It is virtuous to stay true to
your values and change yourself to keep contributing meaningfully to
society.

-- 
Caleb Herbert
KE0VVT
816-892-9669
https://bluehome.net/csh

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