Re: [DotGNU]To What Degree Jabber?

[David Sugar]

I believe Bradley is correct that collectivily (GNU Enterprise, 
phpGroupWare, GNUCOMM) we have already agreed to use XMLRPC for GNU 
groupware standards.  Beyond that, there was some discussion of using SOAP.

The problem Jabber tries to solve is an important one, and one not 
solved by pure RPC systems since they are not designed as peer to peer. 
It is clear we do need some peer to peer solution we can all agree 
upon, whether it's to use Jabber's protocols or something else (Beep 
perhaps?).  

I have no issue in principle with Jabber, as there are both free 
software implimentations of jabber servers and there is no proprietary 
aspect to the protocol itself.  However, this needs to be discussed with 
the other projects as well.

Bradley M. Kuhn wrote:

> Richard Stallman <address@hidden> wrote:
>
> >    XMLRPC, SOAP, jabber:middleware
>
> > How do they relate to the use of the GNU Groupware Standards?  Are they
> > alternatives to it?  Do they do different jobs in a complementary way?
>
> These are lower level communications standards; GNU Groupware Standards
> would be implemented on top of them.  The GNU Groupware Standards folks
> agreed that XML-RPC would be used when it had enough functionality to do
> the job, and SOAP when that wasn't enough.
>
> Some representatives of GNU Enterprise, DotGNU, and phpGroupware should
> probably have a conversation about how jabber:middleware will fit in to
> all those projects.  (It sounds like the DotGNU folks believe it will be a
> win for some things, but we should get input from the other GNU groups
> that might need to integrated with it before we charge ahead).
>
>
> Meanwhile, our Chief Sysadmin (and general cool hacker) at the FSF, Paul
> Fisher, has suggested that we should look seriously at BEEP and APEX as
> well.  BEEP is defined by RFC's 3080 and 3081, and there is an IETF
> Working Group for APEX.
>
> There is also an IETF draft for XML-RPC over BEEP, and for SOAP over BEEP.
> So, we don't have to abandon use of SOAP or XML-RPC if we choose to use
> BEEP.  APEX, as I understand it, would serve the same middleware level of
> XML-RPC, SOAP, and/or jabber:middleware.
>
> Meanwhile, Paul mentioned to me that APEX/BEEP is probably
> technologically superior to jabber:middleware, because it was designed
> from the ground up to be generalized, whereas jabber:middleware was
> original for instant messaging only and later adapted for other
> applications.
>
> I suggest we have another IRC meeting with the folks involved to discuss
> this.  The GNU Enterprise folks do, in the end, want to develop an easy
> API for these protocols that abstract them away, and only for more
> esoteric uses would one need to get into the guts of them.  This is a hard
> job, and it will probably take them a while to get there, so it is good in
> the meantime to have a "pecking order" of RPC-ish protocols that are
> favored by GNU projects.
>
>   -- bkuhn