FW: Interactive guide for new users (was: Re: Gather a list of confusions beginner tend to have)

[Drew Adams]

[Was bitten by the Reply All misses emacs-devel thing again...]

>> But the tutorial is not just about keybindings.  It explains a lot of 
>> other turf, mainly the important concepts: buffer, window, mode line, 
>> etc.
>
> A new user does not need to understand those subtleties.

See below.  You seemed earlier to say that such things as
the mode-line are essential for a new user to understand.

> >> They are indeed, I'm not denying this.  My point of view here is: what
> >> are the most essential things that a user needs to know to use Emacs if
> >> we have no more than three minutes?  Clearly (at least to me) it is
> >> possible to use Emacs without knowing what a "buffer" or a "window" is.
> >
> > How would they even understand the doc strings without knowing what's a
> > buffer and what's a window?  We have the Glossary section in the manual,
> > for that very reason.
> 
> Again my point of view is: what are the most essential things that a user
> needs to know to use Emacs if we have no more than three minutes?  The
> point is to create a minimal configuration wizard / guided tour to
> introduce them to the most essential things and help them to create a
> minimal configuration with which they would feel "at home", instead of
> having the "this is weird" feeling.

The "most essential things" are not cursor movements.
The arrow keys, familiar to all, suffice for that,
to begin with.

> You mention "doc strings", but why on earth would
> a user who just started using Emacs read doc strings?

The most essential thing, if you really expect something
in less than 3 minutes, is _how to ask Emacs_, so that
you can learn more when you need/want to.

And yes, that starts with help commands, which means
doc strings.

C-h C-h, if nothing else.

Then C-h k, C-h m, C-h v, C-h f, C-h i,...

And you, yourself, said something similar earlier:

> And I still think that a short "guided tour" would be
> useful at the end: what/where is the minibuffer and
> what is its purpose, what does the 
> mode-line contain, how to find help (here I would list
> C-h m, C-h p, C-h k / C-h w / C-h a, C-h l, C-h ?), ...

And there you also seem to support what Eli says about
the need to introduce fundamental concepts - Emacs things.
You mention the minibuffer and the mode-line.  He mentions
buffers, windows, etc.

ALL of that is needed: basic Emacs thingies + how to ask Emacs.