Re: emacs-w3m question

[Xah]

On Nov 8, 10:57 am, Rupert Swarbrick <rswarbr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> For example, in other part your post, you said something idiotic about
> >> the use of Shift key, then Rupert Swarbrick put in 60 words post that
> >> effectively says ???yeah, i still use emacs thru telnet too!!!??? Can you
> >> imagine, soon other tech geeker will chime in and insist emacs is
> >> still used thru telnet? and soon more tech geeker will insist that
> >> Emacs is not technically a Microsoft Word?
>
> > :-)  What I said was, I think, true.  People do use Emacs over comms
> > lines.  Emacs developers actively resist the "tyranny of the majority".
>
> Oh sorry Xah, you're in a killfile so I've only just noticed I got a
> mention. But, yeah, I think it's pretty amazing that emacs is usable
> over ssh (no, I don't allow telnet logins to my laptop). Before there's
> a tirade about ancient lispniks who are out of touch with the real
> world, I'll point out that I'm an undergrad.

the point was not about whether emacs is still used with telnet.

The point was, that often it is the case in debates of tech geekers,
they don't see the whole picture of argument but like to pick bones.
Then later readers read the pone-picking message and feel obliged to
post to concur, oblivious of what the debate was about.

In our case, it is this Alan guy, who read my article:

Why Emacs's Keyboard Shortcuts Are Painful
http://xahlee.org/emacs/emacs_kb_shortcuts_pain.html

on the section “No Employment of the Shift Key”, and all this moron
can say is that emacs is still used thru telnet.

> Anyway, what other editors except v** and emacs would allow you to do
> something like that?

do you mean the ability to edit files remotely?

BBEdit, somewhat the standard (most popular) editor on the Mac
throughout the 1990s, and today possibly still top 5 among Mac, can
edit files remotely. In fact, i think majority (if not all), major
editors/IDEs today can do that.

(for some survey of text editor popularity, and the importance of such
study, see:
Text Editors Popularity
http://xahlee.org/emacs/text_editor_trends.html
)

also note, the use of telnet/ssh is gradually waning. (in comparison
to, 10 years ago when half of my time in a day job is using emacs thru
telnet/ssh) They are replaced by various ways to get files across the
net. For example, there are Apple and Microsoft software that allows
you to have remote desktops. Then there's various methods of
tunneling. And there are various remote file systems getting more and
more robust besides NFS and Samba, then there's rsync, unison, and
various other sync software from Apple and Microsoft ...

See for example:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remote_desktop_software
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remote_Desktop
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timbuktu_(software)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_Filing_Protocol

(you can also read about rsync, unison, samba, NFS, the follow the
various links to learn about a whole lot more software and protocols
on these areas )

Now, think about this: all these applications that work remotely,
their Shift key shortcuts should be broken! Wow! The Emacs way of
thinking!

telnet itself, one of unix shit, is one of the mothefucking worst
design by itself. This has been criticized like some 20 years ago when
unix is considered the cool kid on the block.

some unix moron is going to mention X-Windows here. They should read:

The X-Windows Disaster
http://xahlee.org/UnixResource_dir/_/The_X-Windows_Disaster.html

> I'm not
> entirely sure what you mean about emacs being like MS Word.

That is for Alan, so that, we can begin to have hundreds of posts
about how emacs is not Microsoft Word and therefore whatever was his
point is wrong.

it's easy. Whenever someone suggest something about emacs, doesn't
matter how well thought, how superior, or what is the nature of it,
all you have to do is to mention that emacs is not Microsoft Word, and
do it in a insistent way with some argumentation, then you'll have
hundreds of posts to support you.

i've seen quite a few absolute morons in comp.emacs and gnu.emacs.help
in the past 3 years since i began to participate frequently. I'd say
Alan is the top 5 among the idiots. You may not be aware, he sincerely
believes that we should stick to ascii, as opposed to unicode.

is he a good guy? i'd say so. Among tech geeking morons, some are
mean, hateful. These i truely despise. They are the scumbags of
society. But Alan is cool in this respect. He's like, the Forrest
Gump. Y'know? The movie that suggests that we'll all be millionaires
and the world will be a better place as long as we have good
intentions, regardless whether we are idiots.

--------------
O, you mentioned kill file. Please read:

http://xahlee.org/UnixResource_dir/writ/kill_file_harmful.html

plain text version follows:

--------------------
Killfile Considered Harmful

Xah Lee, 2000-02-26

In newsgroups, killfile is a playful word meaning that the poster has
placed someone in a blacklist of authors, where their postings will be
automatically hidden from view in their newsreader. Such functionality
of newsreaders originated in unix. In the early 90s or before, it used
to be referred to as “sending someone into /dev/null”, because “/dev/
null” can be used as a way for deleting email program outputs.

The killfile behavior, is simply put: “sweep-under-the-rug”, “bury-
head-in-sand” kind of behavior. Imagine that in a gathering where if
everyone totally ignores other's voices except their own kind, then
what cacophony would result? Similarly, if we ignore the problem of
crime by simply using larger locks for our own doors, what consequence
would result?

We are all human beings. Our surroundings are our organs and affects
us dearly. In newsgroups, inevitably there will be certain individuals
with foul breath at times. Killfile mechanism is a very good feature
to battle such annoyances. This is not a reason for falling for the
convenience of blocking your ears from dissenting voices or the
nonconformists.

The worst thing i hate about it, is the broadcasting of someone being
killfiled. Oftentimes the sole content of a message is “You've been
killfiled”. WHAT GOOD DOES IT DO TO THE COMMUNITY BY SUCH
ANNOUNCEMENT? Is it a warning system for fellow readers to prepare to
follow suit? Or is it a stupid self-righteous act? In the course of a
unpleasant encountering, the killfilers feel the other party being
unworthy of further response but they don't want to be seen as
chickening out so they had to announce it as if saying: “Hello world:
you don't see a returning 'fuck you' from me because _I_ am _smarter_
and took a step ahead of my antagonist and covered my ears, not
because he is correct or anything like that.”. Pride is a human
nature, but unqualified conceit is despicable.

A second motivation for announcing killfile is more explicitly
juvenile. Killfile has several variant names: “You've been
killfiled.”, “plonk” (sound of falling object), “I've send you to /dev/
null” (unixism), and creativity does not seems to cease there, e.g. in
comp.lang.lisp: (plonk 'xah) or signatures that reads “in /dev/null,
they can't hear you scream.”

The reason of these playful variations is precisely literary folly.
The utterer delights in its use since most are wanting of genuine
literary artistry. This adds to the fashion of killfile and its
broadcasting.

Killfile behavior and broadcasting have another curious trait: No
burden of commitment. One cannot really tell if the person really did
the killfile. The decision to make a killfile cry in public does not
carry any weight of responsibility as compared to making a claim,
stating a “fact”, or expressing a opinion. It is simply a variation of
“fuck you”. This too, contributed to its uncontrolled popularity.

  Xah
∑ http://xahlee.org/

☄