[Mldonkey-users] I'm really understanding this finally, I think...

[lenny bruce]

On Monday, December 30, 2002, at 02:57  AM, Taros666 wrote:
> lenny bruce wrote:
> > > > I don't mind uploading but I'm doing a lot more uploading than 
> > > > downloading. I thought the benefit of being able to download from 
> > > > so many people at once was that each person didn't have to upload 
> > > > incredible amounts...
> > >
> > > sum(network_upload) == sum (network_download)
> >
> > I keep seeing this... I assume it means you can only upload what you 
> > download -- but we have ASYMMETRICAL connections. I thought the whole 
> > goal here was to overcome that fact by having us download a little 
> > bit from a tremendous number of people
>
> It still seems people don't understand that...
>
> The sum of ALL uploads in the WHOLE donkey-net
> MUST equal the sum of ALL downloads.

so I was right when I mentioned the ISP in this
we're in this mess because they cheat us out of upload power

THE MORE ASYMMETRICAL YOUR CONNECTION, THE MORE FRUSTRATING DONKEY 
BECOMES.

a situation like mine (1.5Mb/128kb) is simply maddening on the Donkey 
network
because * I'm wondering why it's so darn slow
        * turning the upload to max slows it down even more
        * I have to wait to pay everyone back even if I get what I want 
quickly
        * I can't fix the problem

I actually made it worse by throwing away my prefs when I updated 
MLDonkey.
I was throwing away any credit I earned uploading by getting a new MD4 
ID.



THIS MEANS: the "P2P Politics" I thought I was bitching about
was actually "people trying to explain how the Donkey network functions"

what a brain explosion!


I was wrong and I totally admit it.


> If 100 people have ADSL with 1000 kb/s down and 128 kb/s up,
> the max available download for everyone is 128*100= 12800 kb/s.
> The max possible download of 100000 kb/s (100*1000) for the whole 
> network
> can never be reached! (100000 kb/s- 12800 kb/s = 87200 kb/s,
> so 87% of your possible download bandwidth won't get used!)
>
> About 1 or 2 years ago, the donkey-net was very, very fast!
> Most people that paticipated in the net had same UP and DOWN.
> But since ADSL popped up the "A"=asyncron in ADSL is a big problem.
> In germany most people use t-online and thus you get a download-speed
> of the other peoples upload-speed of about 12-20 Kb/s max (if you are 
> lucky) for new well spread files and this is the expacted value.
>
> If you give 128 kb/s upload you are a leecher
> if you download faster that 128 kb/s!
>
> People in US seem to have better upload-speed.
> When I try some US-files, I often reach 30-40 Kb/s...


THIS SITUATION CAN NEVER GET ANY BETTER

the worst part is that the tendency of the ISP
is to offer less to dumber people for the same money


in Seattle recently, QWest quit the ISP business to focus solely on DSL.
They tried to force their customers "automatically" to MSN for their 
ISP.
Where QWest had been offering "the standard DSL deal" of 1.5Mb/128kb,
the deal MSN offered people was extremely predatory (256/128 and 
768/128).
I was shocked that people were so stupid that they went along with it
because they were getting significantly less for the same money.

you don't notice the Donkey equality problem so much
in a terrible situation like MSN/QWest
because they're not giving you download power either.

I sought and received "the standard DSL deal" from Earthlink 
(1.5Mb/128kb)
but even I'm a moron to accept that deal... because there's still no 
upload.

I "beat the system" only to "carve out my lot in Donkey hell" 
unknowingly.
People who are being cheated will actually be happier with the donkey 
network.

ISPs have to be symmetrical partners in order to get themselves on the 
internet
but then they have the gall to turn around and sell us asymmetrical 
access.


my axiom "DSL only gets worse when they have a chance to re-negotiate 
with us"
is also true with Earthlink as "the standard DSL deal" used to be 
1.5Mb/384kb.

We just can't win!



lenny bruce
address@hidden