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RE: [External] : Re: finding stuff


From: Drew Adams
Subject: RE: [External] : Re: finding stuff
Date: Tue, 26 Jan 2021 23:28:36 +0000

> > The Help command that OP found to be so helpful
> > in this thread, and that was thought to be so
> > hard to discover, is right there in the `Help'
> > menu, hiding in plain sight.  But you have to
> > have a reflex to look under `Help', to find it.
> 
> (OP here.)

The thread OP is actually Tomas Hlavaty.  But yes,
you're the one I meant, by OP.  You mentioned that
you've been using Emacs for decades but you were
unaware of that command.  There's so much we aren't
aware of - all of us.  (That particular command is
about as old as Emacs, BTW.)

> Drew, Are you saying that the help menu contains
> items that are not listed by C-h C-h?  That, to me,
> would be very surprising.

No, I didn't say that or mean to suggest it.  Without
checking, I'd assume, like you, that the `Help' menu
covers all of what `C-h C-h' covers.

My point was only about discoverability.  `C-h C-h'
is a fine way to discover help commands.  So is the
`Help' menu'.  My contribution was to second that
last point, which was first stated in the thread by
Jean Louis.

Specifically, I wanted to point out how helpful the
`Help' menu is, and that the command in question is
there, with the name `Search Documentation Strings'.

And yes, it's also listed with `C-h C-h':

  MORE ADVANCED HELP
  ------------------
  d: Shows Emacs functions and variables whose
     doc matches a regexp.

One can argue about the most helpful words used
to describe this, in terms of discoverability.
Menu `Help' talks about "searching" doc strings.
`C-h C-h' talks about "matching" doc.  And the
command name has the components `apropos' and 
`documentation'.  For users who know about
apropos,  "apropos" helps; for others, it might
not help so much.

> I am not opposed to using the mouse.  I avoid
> menus because they present such a jarring UI
> discontinuity.

Menus are one way to access commands.  Like the
other ways, they have their plusses and minuses.

For help, at least, we have `C-h C-h', which
_groups help commands_.

We don't have much otherwise (e.g. to help
discoverability), when it comes to _grouping_
related commands.  We can have related keys
(e.g. same prefix key or similar key mnemonics).
We have related command names (with some degree
of naming convention).  And we have apropos
(`C-h a' etc.).

Those all help group commands somewhat, and so
help with discoverability.  But each has its
weaknesses in that regard.

If you have a good completion system then you can
also find commands, variables, etc. by their name components etc., or even by 
doc matches - similar
to `apropos-documentation.  (I do that all the
time, using Icicles progressive completion.)

But menus too can aid discoverability, using
hierarchy and grouping (with named groups).

> Your LaCarte sounds intriguing.
> Does interface with completing-read (i.e. can I
> use it in conjunction with Selectrum and friends)?

Yes, you should be able to use it with any
completion system.  Yes, it uses `completing-read'.
___

https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Icicles_-_Nutshell_View#ChippingAway

https://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/Icicles_-_Progressive_Completion



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